Café Philos: an internet café

Women aren't special, like men. Women can wear men's clothes and be cute or sexy, but men wearing women's clothes? An abomination. Women's clothes are icky. Women can want "men's" jobs, but men cannot want "women's" jobs, for fear of being thought weak. Because women are weak. Women can be raped in the Middle East, and executed for tempting the man, where the man is not punished.

And to take it one step further, though this is a completely different kind of issue . . .

If a good-looking guy walks up to a strange woman and propositions her out of nowhere, and she refuses, her friends will applaud her for being sensible.

If a good-looking woman propositions a strange man and he refuses, his friends will think he's either stupid or gay.

Wow, good point. I have never thought of that. I wonder how many people have. Seems like it is not really respect or safety that is driving all of this it is hate and fear.

I seem to remember hearing something about "women's liberation" and "feminism" when I was growing up...

Guess it was just another fictional concept like fairy tales and Santa Claus.

Thanks you for that. I never noticed the most obvious absurdity. For me, its not so much that police should be monitoring heterosexual harassment but how ludicrous and immoral the police harassment of gay interaction and expression is.

If sex in public is bad, then the quest to bring justice to sex in public should be applied across the table fairly, whether it's homosexual, heterosexual or otherwise. If it's not applied fairly then don't apply it at all.

And while I feel it is a separate issue, I agree completely with woundedhart: when it comes to gender expression, females get far more freedom to cross gender lines than males. It's quite unfortunate. The reality is that women took a stand and fought for that right. I should like to see more men and transgenders stand up for the right for males to wear skirts, dresses and other feminine garments without ridicule or reprisal.

Back in early '90's, WLS AM radio in Chicago had Don Wade & Roma talk show. It was a pretty smart show but I don't think it survived into the bimbo era. They often played off each other, doing 'devil's advocate'. One time they were talking about gays in the military. As best I can remember, probably simplified a bit:

Don: "Well in the military, you're going to be in pretty close quarters. You could be in barracks or in a foxhole. And I wouldn't want one of those guys propositioning me. I mean, they're not all delicate little pansies and sissies. Some of them are pretty big guys. What if one of them wouldn't take "no" for an answer?"

Roma: "Congratulations, Don; now you know how women feel all the time!"

Heterosexual men are socialized to be "in control" in matters of sex. When aggression is added to the mix, it can be violent. As Gavin DeBecker says, "Men are afraid women will laugh at them. Women are afraid men will kill them."

Being propositioned by a gay man reverses that role and, filtered through personal insecurities, unrecognized and suppressed curiosity, and stereotypes of gay men as total sex maniacs, puts the hetereosexual man in a hell of an uncomfortable perceived position.

Nice, incisive observation. I observe that your double standard crosses two boundaries: the male-female and the hetero-homo.

So, applying it differently: are women expected to graciously put up with lesbian women who come on to them? Are homosexual men expected to graciously put up with heterosexual women who come on to them? (Just completing the logical set of questions).

Shows we have a long way to go!